Michelin’s on a 600?

I run the 190 rear when ive ran the Michelin evo's I like others I personally know like the mid corner stability that the 190 offers "above" the 180 but the 180 is "more" flickable on transitions. I wouldn't worry about "edge grip" all the major manufactures are very good its all in your feel and when and where you get on the throttle and your smoothness etc....
as far as keeping heat in them.. do you run warmers? if not give them a 1.5 to 2 lap time to come up to temp then run your times and be mindful if you do use warmers hit and get it as long as your pace is solid you'll be fine.

tire techs will have more in depth insight

 

If you are turning 1:05 lap times at Tally, I'd figure you would be in A group already.

Look at the Pirelli Supercorsa TD if you don't feel comfortable with the Michelin Evo's. I just ordered a set, although not going anywhere near your pace, but I read good things about them being Q4 killers and don't require warmers. They also come in a 180/60 rear, so you won't have to worry about a distorted tire profile running a 190 tire on a 600 width rim.

I also spoke to an instructor about them and he had personal experience with the Pirelli TD. He had nothing but good things to say about them. He specifically stated in his experience and opinion, nothing else on the market touches the Pirelli TD without moving to a full race tire Michelin or Pirelli.

The Michelin Evo's you mention are classed alongside the Q4 and Pirelli Supercorsa TD, which are badass track tires that heat up to temp quicker than full on race rubbers. Of the 3, to my knowledge the Pirelli TD seems to come out on top. I didn't even know the tire existed until someone else recommended it to me on here a couple weeks ago, but my research and talking to others with experience on them has me really looking forward to trying them out. In my particular sizes (160/60/17 and 120/70/17) they were $352 shipped from tracksidetires.com. Price point is really good.

https://tracksidetires.com/product/pirelli-diablo-supercorsa-td/

 

From what I've gathered and this may be too simple a generalization, but the 180/60's being made are basically a 190 section tire made to fit a 5.5 rim.

As far as the problems encountered with the 600's running 190's, the issue is if you have the bike perfectly set up for a 180/55 then jump to 190/55 or 190/60, you may run into issues with lack of weight transfer. You can rip up a perfectly new tire at a relatively slow pace by basically being on the throttle. It's dramatic. Dave Moss calls it a cold tear from geometry, i think.

If this is happening, I would drop the rear a couple turns and possibly soften rear compression. I think Moss says go back to the smaller tire...

 

Ah, you mentioned the Michelin Evos, which is essentially the same type of tire as the Q4, even the EVO slick. That's why I recommended the Pirelli TD. I'd imagine you could pick up any full dot race tire or full race slick and be tickled pink if you are running warmers.

Also, I assume you've worked with instructors and they've watched you on track? I wouldn't think you'd have any problems running rear to mid pack in A group turning 1:05 times as long as your lines are good and you ride predictably. You'd have more room to run uninterrupted laps without getting held up by slower riders in some turns.

 

I think when most people say EVO they mean the powercups or powerslicks which are not like a Q4, but more like a GPA-Pro or a Dunlop slick. These types of tires should be used with warmers to prevent cold tearing. The Q4, as you know, does not need warmers. Sorry if I misunderstood, but your post made it seem like this was not the case.

 

I'm 99% sure the EVO denotes that warmers aren't necessary. There are Power Cup EVO's and Power Slick EVO's, both of which are supposed to warm up faster than full race tires, then there are the Power Performance Cup and Power Slick Comp which are both full race tires that you should use warmers with. I mean you can use warmers with the EVO line too, but just like Q4's, you don't have to.

Michelin lineup on STG's website.
https://www.sportbiketrackgear.com/motorcycle-tires/track/?_bc_fsnf=1&brand=190

Someone correct me if I am wrong, but I'm 99% sure that's how it goes. Michelin also just came out with a couple new tires that I am not as familiar with though, one of which is called the Power GP. Looks more like a successor of the Power RS, but I'm not certain.

 

The power cup evos and powerslick evos were the race tires before the new Performance series came out (if you don't count the competition slick from a year or two ago). I think the evos are still the only supersport racing option from Michelin. The Michelin Power RS was the tire I've always seen compared to the Q4 that doesn't require a warmer. I'm not familiar with the new Power GP either.

Anyway, the Michelin guys used to recommend warmers for the Evos. Maybe that's changed over the last year or two. I run Dunlop slicks and have contemplated switching to Michelins as they are onsite at STT events, and the Evos seem comparable to the USA Dunlops I've been running based on my experience at the track, and talking to other riders. All the A-group guys run warmers on these tires, and I'm told they will cold tear if run hard without warmers (just like the Dunlops). The Q4 is a great tire, but it can't compete with the Evo's at a fast A-pace, especially if it's warm out.

The new Michelin performance tires are pricey, so I will stick with my Dunlops or give the Evo's a try. I didn't know that the Performance tires had officially become available so thanks for sharing the info.

Matt

 

Maybe I incorrectly classed the EVO's and the Power RS. I always pictured the Power RS being direct competition to the Dunlop Q3/Q3+. In fact, there is a thread on here comparing those two tires and most everybody with experience of both say the Q3 is the top performer over the Power RS, which is why I went with Q3's instead of the Power RS on my bike. Have been impressed by the Q3, but ready for the next level now. My Pirelli TD's came in last week, was excited to try them at Barber in a couple weeks, but that plan got crapped on since they cancelled the event.

 

When I bought my bike it came with Cups. THE ONLY downside is if ambient temp is 40f they don't like tar snakes (think Grattan)
https://www.visordown.com/reviews/product/michelin-supersport-evo-and-power-cup-evo-tyre-review

Cups had more than I needed. If you know your going to ride for a couple of years warmers are in your future.

All I can say for me Cup's ROCK. Go Michelin

 

Happy Sunday to all, I would like to make this conversation as simple as it can be....and ,yes this whole tire thing can be confusing..lol. Michelin has a completely new line up out that replaced the EVO series tires this year, except for the small bikes. The new Michelin race tire is called the "2" series. They are called the Michelin Power Cup 2 and Power Slick 2. Michelin even came out with a dedicated trackday tire called the Michelin Power GP. I will tell you that Michelin added some of its Moto GP platform technology into the new "2" models and has been an absolute success so far this year. They offer superior grip at all temps with out you having to buy multiple compounds because of the Adaptive Carcass Technology. The also offer extremely long wear characteristics and have a better price pont than last year's EVO tires. And just so everyone is clear on something, they do not need warmers to be utilized, especially the Cup 2 model. The Cup 2 is a DOT tire and comes stock on a few 2020 motorcycles. If you would like to have detailed and more in depth conversation, please do not hesitate to reach out to me directly at 734-210-8859. Thanks a bunch, Dave.

 

Asking this type of question on a specific site will give you specific results. The website hosts and your super friendly trackside vendor are there for business. You will do fine with almost anything up until you want to be competitive, then people won’t be as honest with you.

look at Pirelli.